Speeches by Berry.

“It is a pleasure to serve under you today, Mrs Lewell-Buck. I do not support the Conservative amendment. A lot of the discussion in Committee has been about reducing the risk of harm to potentially vulnerable people and people caught up in these frauds, who might not deserve to be punished in any way. I would not suppo…”

“I forgot to make a point earlier about the common practice with penalty notices of offering a person the ability to pay less if they pay sooner, but if they exercise their right to appeal, they lose that discount. That is how penalty notices are often presented. The Minister assured us that people will be able to state…”

“I have more serious questions about this part of the Bill than I have had about any other. I question the additional penalty notices: what goals do they have and will they be achieved? I can see that Ministers seek to go beyond simply recovering lost funding, when it comes to issues of error or fraud that results from …”

“T7. Expanding UK airport capacity has a very shaky case for economic benefits, because business is not increasing its use of air travel, and the UK sends three times as many tourists out by plane as we welcome in. Will the Chancellor urgently publish her evidence of any net benefits to the economy from airport expansio…”

“It is a pleasure to serve under you, Sir Desmond. I have two quick questions for the Minister. I associate myself with the comments about ongoing scrutiny and consultation. I am pleased that the most consequential of these potential new regulations will be subject to the affirmative procedure, but it seems like a lot t…”

“I thank the Deputy Prime Minister for, in particular, her comments about the way in which residents were treated. There have been strong recommendations for a review of the Civil Contingencies Act 2004. My former role involved listening to and trying to support the many local community organisations that were dealing w…”

“Q I want to ask a couple of questions of clarification. Minister Western, are you open to a negative eventual human rights verdict on this? Many witnesses have said they need answers from the code of conduct, and we know that rights around data protection, privacy and discrimination are engaged by this. If, once we hav…”

“Q Do you have anything more to say about what the unintended consequences of the Bill might be? Jasleen Chaggar: We are really concerned about the unintended consequences of the Bill. We appreciate that there has been an effort to tackle fraud and error, which is a serious problem, but we also have to consider the adve…”

“Q Thank you for coming along. I think we should ask you the same general questions that we have asked all the other witnesses who have given evidence today. Do you believe that the Bill is a proportionate way of dealing with fraud and error in the DWP? I think that has been put to you, but I want to be clear. Given the…”

“Q Disabled people who receive direct payments have expressed some concern that there can be underspends and that these can build up. They have asked for a particular account to be ringfenced for that, and essentially not looked at in relation to these measures. Is that feasible? What is your lead time for knowing that …”

“Okay. Even with that title? Joshua Reddaway: Even with that title.”

“Q That is helpful, because a lot of people have said it is contingent. I want to ask about one more thing to do with error. You said earlier that you were aiming to reduce the amount of overpayment through these processes, but will that also relate to underpayments? What percentage of error, in terms of innocent people…”

“Yes. The other powers that you mentioned already exist and are being transferred to a new place where things are conducted. Eligibility verification in the form that it is written is quite novel. Alex Rothwell: Does His Majesty’s Revenue and Customs not have the ability to conduct those inquiries?”

“Q I want to go back to the question on proportionality. The previous witness emphasised that she was concerned that the eligibility-verification powers might go beyond proportionality and risk additional intrusion. When you are commenting, are you commenting on those powers as well, or mainly on the other parts of the …”

“Q Sorry, Chair, the second question I asked about the percentage of error was not answered. What percentage of error do you think would be acceptable, in terms of innocent people being targeted for investigation? Andrew Western: I am not prepared to put a percentage on it. We would have to see what came out. We have do…”

“Q I just want to clarify that if someone’s financial situation gets better, you withdraw the payment, but if you saw from the data you are collecting that their situation had got worse and they were starting to face difficulties, you would not seek to send someone in to try to increase the payment. Andrew Western: I am…”

“Q Those are helpful things to know. Did you have any more to say about vulnerable customers? I know we have had some representations from disabled people, for example. Eric Leenders: Certainly. I will just build on Dan’s point regarding change requirements, to give a picture of the timespan involved. Typically, a chang…”

“Q To follow up directly on that, the Government have not really been clear yet which further benefits might be added to the workload in future. Are you happy that this is left open in the Bill? Daniel Cichocki: I do not think we take a view on the scope of individual benefits for which this is applied. The key principl…”

“Q Are there any other issues in your consumer duties, particularly your duties towards vulnerable account holders, that you have raised with the Government? The Minister has helpfully asked you that question in general terms, but I thought there may be other issues. Going back to Daniel’s earlier comment, can you clari…”

“Q It does. Do you think the Bill does enough to deal with that issue? Joshua Reddaway: I am saying I do not think this Bill is about that issue.”