Speeches by Kohler.

“That is not my question. My question was why the profit clause was not changed when the whole basis of the contract was different because so much more of it was hotel accommodation, which had a higher base cost and therefore percentage profits would make a lot more money for these providers? Why was the profit clause n…”

“I would like to know why that clause was not changed. We have had many contractual changes. Given that the whole basis of the contract changed because lots of it was hotel accommodation and far more expensive, why did you not change the profit share clause? Mr Ridley, any thoughts?”

“Is it a percentage or an actual amount? The National Audit Office says it is profit divided by cost. It is important, because the cost of dispersal accommodation is £20 per person and the cost of hotel accommodation is £160 per person. You set those contracts assuming most of it would be dispersal. Much of it was and s…”

“I am not asking for figures.”

“Not divided by cost? It is not a percentage? According to the National Audit Office it is profit divided by cost, and that is important. You are saying it is profit minus cost. Are we talking about cash profits that trigger it, or percentages of profit over cost?”

“It is based on profit over cost. That is the calculation, is it?”

“Are these profit share clauses still based on mark-up exceeding a percentage? Profit divided by cost; is that how they are—”

“You were not there, though, when these invoices were paid. Mr Ridley, do you know why the Home Office processes were not working?”

“Given you were not there at the time—”

“I will come back to Stay Belvedere.”

“I am going to ask about Stay Belvedere later.”

“No; I am addressing that to the Home Office. My last question involves Clearsprings. Before I ask it I want to declare an interest, as I have done previously. I refer participants to my register of interests as one of my donors, Safwan Adam, has an interest in Stay Belvedere Hotels, which is of course a subcontractor o…”

“That is true, although benchmarking still could have been done, in my view, but I have heard your answer—”

“The Home Office has a contractual right to benchmark the service. We understand from the National Audit Office that benchmarking has not occurred. Why not? Why have you not benchmarked it against comparators as you can under the contract?”

“Why is that a slow process? Why can that not just be done? Why does that take a while? Why can you just not say that every room that can be shared will be shared?”

“So, without capturing the data, you are confident that the suppliers of accommodation are maximising the efficiency of these rooms?”

“Mr Ridley, would it be useful for the Home Office to collect that data to make sure you are maximising the efficiency of this process?”

“I wrote to you in March about this issue and asked about the Home Office figures on sharing of rooms, and you said the Home Office does not record those figures. It only records the numbers in a hotel and not the number of shared rooms. If we want to cut down costs, we should work out whether or not we are sharing all …”

“So the Home Secretary has changed the position. Now sharing of rooms is a good thing, yes? I just want to establish that.”

“With respect, we know this, but I want to focus on the sharing of rooms. What is the position?”