Speeches by Smith.

“Let me try to explain. ASF checks were introduced in 2022. We work really closely in Dover together. We found a fairly significant increase in meat importations. That gives an indication, data and more intelligence that then leads to further success. You are actually right that more activity leads to success, but some …”

“There is a role for deterrence, yes, absolutely.”

“That is a good question at the moment. Border Force does everything it can with the current structures and resources that it has in place. We have a very good working relationship with DEFRA and I can explain the structure of our working relationship and how that information is shared, if you would like me to.”

“No.”

“I cannot comment on those previous figures, sorry, no.”

“We do not publish port-specific data. At national level, I can speak to the last three calendar years. In 2022, there were approximately 2,400 seizures and 128 tonnes were seized. In 2023, there were approximately 2,900 seizures and 164 tonnes. In 2024, there were approximately 2,600 seizures and 235 tonnes. That is en…”

“Border Force does not have responsibility for prosecution in any of our prohibitions and restrictions. That is a question for DEFRA. DEFRA has the policy and is responsible for the prosecution policy.”

“It might help if I explain the structure first and how we work with DEFRA and other agencies to apply our controls at the frontline. The model is broadly the same for whatever agency we are dealing with, whether that is to deal with illegal meat or illegal drugs. We have a steering structure at the strategic level. We …”

“It is a priority and we take it very seriously in the context of the conversations we have across Government about our strategic responsibilities. We deal with whatever we are told is important from a DEFRA perspective. It goes into our model and our model tells the frontline officers what to look for and what to detec…”

“I disagree. I am afraid I do not agree with that and I do not think Lucy would either. We work in very close collaboration with our colleagues in Dover and around the country to do as much as we can in this space.”

“Yes, to do as much as we can in this space, given the model that I have explained to the Committee with the resources that we have available to do what we can do.”

“I cannot comment on whether organised crime is involved in illegal meat importations. That is a question for DEFRA. It owns the intelligence on illegal meat importation, so I cannot comment, I am afraid.”

“I am afraid I cannot, no. I cannot comment.”

“It is because it is a matter for DEFRA to answer, I am afraid. I do not have any information that I can share with you.”

“DEFRA shares with us appropriate information through the intelligence-sharing gateway. Whatever it understands about illegal meat importation is shared via that gateway. We then have a Home Office intelligence team that takes data from a range of different organisations and they plough that into our frontline service t…”

“I do not know enough about illegal meat smuggling, because it is not my area of responsibility. We are responsible for detecting it and referring it to other agencies. We are not responsible for the strategy or the intelligence-gathering. It is not part of Home Office’s responsibility to gather intelligence on illegal …”

“No. We do not do any of that end‑to‑end assessment.”

“Data from all of the detections and seizures goes on to our database, which is available for analysis. Yes, there are obvious trends that you see in Dover.”

“The countries that export meat will be the countries that we see vehicles from—those that export meat that have restrictions. Lucy is probably better placed to answer that question specifically, but eastern Europe is one of the source areas for this meat.”

“A long time ago, yes.”